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Computer Components CPU

#1   Kuchiyose 

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    Posted 08 January 2008 - 04:05 PM

    Ok as a while ago I asked what OS I should use for a pc I'm building, I know what I'm going to use, now iv got another question, I bought CPU (AMD version) with a clocking speed of 3.2 (dual core this is) and cache of level 2. Would you say this is a good cpu because I got pretty lucky on the price from overclockers.co.uk. And since I'm building a multimedia/gaming machine would you say it was a good cpu for it? Iv also got the motherboard that compatible with AMD cpu's.

    #2   Toasty 

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      Posted 10 January 2008 - 01:42 AM

      Alright, first off, ALL processors have L1 and L2 cache's, and some have an L3 cache.

      Personally, I prefer Intel processor's over AMD's. Regardless, a 3.2Ghz dual core processor will have plenty of power.

      But, first, tell me if you have a motherboard picked out. If not, tell me your price limit for a processor and I'll look for a good one.

      #3   Mallick 

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        Posted 10 January 2008 - 02:40 AM

        View PostKuchiyose, on Jan 8 2008, 02:05 PM, said:

        Iv also got the motherboard that compatible with AMD cpu's.

        that should answer the question

        #4   Toasty 

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          Posted 10 January 2008 - 03:04 AM

          Okay, well is it picked out or bought already?

          Also, you can't pick a CPU just on it's clock speed, or the size of the cache's. You have to look at the FSB speed. You could have a quad core CPU running at 3+Ghz, and it'll suck if it has a FSB speed of say, 100Mhz. Luckily though, no one's been stupid enough to make a processor like that. :P

          But the first thing to do, is to find a motherboard with a good chipset, one that has the right amount of PCI/AGP/PCI-E/whatever slots for what you're doing, and one that has a decent FSB speed support.

          If you can, give me a link to where you found your motherboard.

          [EDIT] I did some looking around, and it looks like that even AMD's new Phenom processor's don't beat Intel's, except for in a few situations. The Intel CPU's outperform in most cases. I'd get an Intel board if I were you.

          #5   Max 

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            Posted 10 January 2008 - 07:11 AM

            No, please do not listen to that last suggestion. If you've bought an AMD processor, do not buy an Intel motherboard, unless you are willing to throw away the money spent on your processor (and the motherboard you may already have).

            Sure, AMD's parts do not stack up to the current Intel parts, but if you've bought parts and can't return them, then don't worry about it and just keep going. AMD now makes it's own chipsets, and nVidia still makes excellent chipsets for AMD CPUs as well. If you give us your budget and the model number of the CPU you bought (e.g., X2 6000+), then we can probably give you some suggestions.

            #6   Kuchiyose 

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              Posted 10 January 2008 - 03:55 PM

              Don't worry I know that AMD motherboards can't have intel and intels motherboards don't allow AMDs (due to the chip pins or something).

              Yeah I got the motherboard with the CPU (I should of said so before) here the info:
              Audio Output

              Audio Codec
              Realtek ALC889A

              Compliant Standards
              DTS Connect
              High Definition Audio

              Sound Output Mode
              7.1 channel surround

              Type
              Sound card

              Cache Memory

              Type
              None

              Header

              Compatibility
              PC

              Model
              GA-MA790X-DS4

              Packaged Quantity
              1

              Product Line
              Gigabyte

              Key Information

              Audio
              High Definition Audio (8-channel)

              FireWire
              FireWire

              FireWire Ports Configuration
              3 x FireWire

              Network
              2 x Gigabit Ethernet

              Storage
              ATA-133
              Serial ATA-300 (RAID)

              Storage Ports Configuration
              1 x ATA, 4 x SATA

              USB Ports Configuration
              10 x USB

              Mainboard

              64-bit Processors Compatibility
              Built-in

              BIOS Type
              Award

              Chipset Type
              AMD 790X

              Compatible Processors
              Athlon 64
              Athlon 64 FX
              Athlon 64 X2
              Opteron 1000 series
              Phenom
              Phenom FX
              Sempron

              Data Bus Speed
              2600 MHz

              Form Factor
              ATX

              I/O Controller
              ATI SB600

              Multi-Core Support
              Dual-Core

              Power Connectors
              24-pin main power connector
              4-pin ATX12V connector
              8-pin ATX12V connector

              Processor Socket
              Socket AM2+

              Supported RAM Integrity Check
              ECC

              Supported RAM Speed
              PC2-5300
              PC2-6400
              PC2-8500

              Supported RAM Technology
              DDR II SDRAM

              Mainboard Features

              Additional Connectors (Optional)
              2 x IEEE 1394 (FireWire)
              4 x Hi-Speed USB

              BIOS Features
              ACPI 1.0b support
              DMI 2.0 support
              SMBIOS 2.4 support

              Hardware Features
              ATI CrossFireX technology support
              Chassis intrusion detection
              Q-Flash
              Quad BIOS
              Silent-Pipe

              Manual Settings
              Chipset voltage
              CPU frequency
              Processor core voltage

              Miscellaneous

              Compatibility
              AMD LIVE! Ready

              Compliant Standards
              Plug and Play
              RoHS

              Modem

              Type
              None

              Networking

              Data Link Protocol
              Ethernet
              Fast Ethernet
              Gigabit Ethernet

              Network Controller
              Realtek RTL8111B

              Type
              Network adapter

              RAM

              Features
              Two DDR channels



              Max ram Supported Size
              16 GB



              Controller Interface Type
              Serial ATA II/DMA/ATA-133/ATA-100(Ultra)

              ATI crossfire X technology. PCI-e 2.0

              dual pci-e 2.0 graphic interface (8x2)
              DDR2 1066

              One thing I'm never sure of is the chipsets on the box it has: 790X chipsets (also before i start building I bought a guide on how to build PC's since it gives good info on PSU statics and graphics cards since the confuse me most, before I started building but i still don't understand the chipsets). Overall I know RAMS, sound cards and other parts to a pc and osftware is easy to set up in the BIOS so that part is covered.

              My budget for certain parts vary my budget for the motherboard and cpu was 200 pounds max (maybe a little higher for motherboard).

              The CPU: 3.2 Ghz clocking speed. 2000MHz Hypertransport, 2MB L2 Cache AMD Athlon 64 X2 dual core processor 6400 +

              #7   Toasty 

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                Posted 10 January 2008 - 07:56 PM

                @Max: Well I didn't mean to throw away the motherboard if he already had it, only to look for a different one if it was just picked out and not bought.

                Anyway, most of my experience is with Intel stuff, but I know a bit about AMD's too, so I might be of some help.

                But, from what I've found, you MIGHT have problems using using a RAID configuration on this board, because it's southbridge (SB600) doesn't like RAID that much (apparently. I've only found one refrence to that), but it is supposed to support RAID. Not sure what's going on there. If worse comes to worse, you shouldn't have problems just using a normal configuration though.

                The board also has decent overclocking capabilities, with a maximum supported CPU voltage of 2.3 volts. 4 slots for 240 Pin DDR2 SDRAM running at up to 1066Mhz, and a max FSB speed of 2600Mhz. It looks like a pretty good board. It should run pretty quick with 2GB of RAM and that processor you've got.

                However, it doesn't look like it supports quad core CPU's, but that might be incorrect, as the Phenom is the first AMD processor to have 4 cores (it also comes in dual core models though), and it just recently came out. It's supposed to fit that socket though.

                Anyway, it looks like you need a
                • Hard Drive: I'd suggest Seagate as a brand.
                • RAM: Kingston has a REALLY nice deal that comes with most of their sticks. As long as they still support the model you're using, they'll replace your RAM free for life ANY time it breaks down. So if a stick dies on you for some reason, no worries.
                • Graphics Card: I'm a fan of Nvidia myself, but you should probably go with a Radeon since this board supports Crossfire instead of SLi (Nvidia's version of Crossfire), which is great if you're going to use more than one GPU.
                • Power Supply: I don't really have any reccomendations here, and it sounds like your book has you pretty covered. But I'd suggest getting a 1000W power supply or more if you plan on upgradeing in the future.
                • CD/DVD Drive: I've got a Sony one that's never had any problems at all.
                • Optional: Floppy drive. I'd get this if you have extra space in your case. Floppy's come in handy for a number of things.
                I'd look at Max's suggestions first though.

                #8   Eugine 

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                  Posted 10 January 2008 - 08:35 PM

                  Floppy drives are pretty obsolete now imo. Don't even consider them.

                  #9   Toasty 

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                    Posted 10 January 2008 - 08:54 PM

                    Floppy drives aren't nesiscarily obsolete. Sure, CD's/DVD's have higher capacity, but floppy's are harder to damage. Plus, it comes in handy for makeing boot disks.

                    You could make boot disks with CD's, but it's easier to make them with floppy's. But I'd only add a floppy in there if you've got space to spare.

                    #10   Max 

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                      Posted 12 January 2008 - 08:04 AM

                      I'm not sure that it's really necessary to get a 1000W PSU, unless you decide to do two "high-end" cards in CrossFire. But seeing as ATI/AMD doesn't have true high-end cards and they are more focused on power management than nVidia, I doubt you'd ever need the 1KW PSU.

                      All the other suggestions here sound fine. You might want to post your final parts list before you hit checkout.

                      #11   Eugine 

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                        Posted 12 January 2008 - 04:03 PM

                        Maaaxx, would you get a floppy drive? Need some expert opinion here ^_~

                        #12   Max 

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                          Posted 13 January 2008 - 07:06 AM

                          Floppy drives are really a matter of preference and need. Some people use floppy drives alot, some people never use them. I've moved on to using USB thumbdrives for quick storage purposes, but sometimes you still need floppies for certain system issues (though most new PCs now support booting from USB). Floppy drives only cost a few dollars, so it can't hurt to get one if you think you might need one.

                          #13   Kuchiyose 

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                            Posted 30 January 2008 - 12:25 PM

                            Iv got a floppy drive on my old pc and iv got lots of room so I'll just add it, i cna add at least 4 drives to my new desk top so its okay for room XD Ok right iv found a graphics card and this is the worst when it comes to my memory... and my wallet. basically graphics card are confusing, too many and i want one thats awesome! So opinions! Ok iv found this graphics card but I really want a powerful one (like this one: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct....amp;subcat=416)

                            or this one: cheaper but less powerful: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct....&subcat=416

                            Also helpful if you can find me others because the first one is going to hurt my wallet 0_o

                            #14   Toasty 

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                              Posted 30 January 2008 - 11:50 PM

                              Like I said, I prefer Nvidia's cards. I think I'll go do a little more research on your motherboard to see which brand would work better, but I'm also going to go look at some reviews for ATI's GPU's and see how they fair. I'll edit this post with my findings.

                              #15   Max 

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                                Posted 31 January 2008 - 07:07 AM

                                With graphics cards, you generally get what you pay for. Cards like the 8800GT and some of the newer ATI cards offer pretty good price/performance ratios, but your level of awesomeness is truly limited by whatever budget you have.

                                #16   Kuchiyose 

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                                  Posted 31 January 2008 - 07:44 AM

                                  Cheers Toasty ^_^ I need all the help I can get with graphcis cards XD

                                  Yeah I thought the same, the more you pay the better I'm guessing.

                                  So now what to pick, also do motherboards limit on what kind of grahpics I use? mines a 16X slot
                                  With ati crossfire support, true it supports it but for the looks of it, it can't use Nvida or can it?
                                  Its PCi-express so I think it could

                                  #17   Max 

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                                    Posted 31 January 2008 - 10:10 AM

                                    Crossfire only allows for use of 2 ATI cards, so no nVidia cards. However, general consensus is that it is better to spend money on one better card than two lesser cards in crossfire, due to compatibility and upgrade-ability reasons. However, you can still use a single nVidia card, you just can't use two of them in tandem.

                                    You can use any PCI-Express card with that motherboard, which is basically any card made in the past 2-3 years. Again, if you post your budget, we may be able to give some suggestions.

                                    #18   Toasty 

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                                      Posted 31 January 2008 - 10:59 AM

                                      The 8800GT is has the best cost to power ratio as far as Nvidia cards go. You can spend $200 on the 8800GT, or spend $400 on the GTS and get less performance. The GT also is nearly on par with the GTX, which is nearly 3 times more expensive.

                                      So if you're going with Nvidia, it's either the 8800 GT, or the 8800 Ultra (for a whopping $1000).

                                      I'm still looking at reviews for ATI cards, so I'll probably have something a later today.

                                      [EDIT] I got the 6666th post in the Technology & Computers forum....^_^

                                      [EDIT 2] Alright, here's some results I've found. Thes first ones here are for the Asus ATI Radeon HD 3870 X2 1024MB you were interested in. Obviously, a higher score is better.

                                      http://www.fpslabs.com/images/stories/reviews/tgribble/r680/shoes_r680_3dmark.jpg

                                      http://www.fpslabs.com/images/stories/reviews/tgribble/r680/shoes_r680_crysis.jpg

                                      http://www.fpslabs.com/images/stories/reviews/tgribble/r680/shoes_r680_bioshock9.jpg

                                      http://www.fpslabs.com/images/stories/reviews/tgribble/r680/shoes_r680_bioshock10.jpg

                                      I included the DirectX 9 and 10 version results so you can see what you'll get if you use XP over Vista.

                                      ATI Radeon HD 3870 X2 (1024MB)
                                      Core Clock: 825MHz
                                      Memory Clock:1800MHz
                                      Memory Type: GDDR3
                                      Memory interface: 256Bit (x2)
                                      Memory capacity: 1024MB
                                      Manufacture Process: 55nm
                                      Transistor Count: ~1333 Million
                                      Math Processing Rate: 994 GFLOPS
                                      Shaders: 640
                                      Standard Shader Model: 4.1 (Vista Only)
                                      Standard DirectX Version: 10.1 (Vista Only)
                                      128-Bit HDR Lighting
                                      8192x8192 HR Textures
                                      Interface: PCIe 2.0


                                      As you can see, the 8800GTS (512MB) outperforms the Radeon HD 3870 X2 (1024MB) for about the same price. Also, keep in mind, the 8800GTS (512MB) scores higher than the 8800GT in the tests because the 8800GT has half the memory. The standard 8800GTS however, does not outperform the 8800GT as shown in the test.

                                      Also note that the benchmark was done before ATI released drivers that were optomized for Crysis, so that's one reason why the GTS mopped the floor with the X2. However, the GTS (512MB) still outperformed the X2 (1024MB) in everything excpet for 3D Mark '06, which ATI cards usually do better in. But, the GTS (512) still does better in real use applications.

                                      But, as you can see, you'll be getting a lot more bang for your buck by going with the 8800GTS (512MB) over the HD 3870 X2 (1024MB).

                                      Link to the article this information was found in.

                                      I'm too tired to go through and do the other card, but here's a link to a review for it.

                                      #19   Kuchiyose 

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                                        Posted 02 February 2008 - 03:21 PM

                                        Ooooo cheers Max, I thought some motherboards could only have certain cards (although this does allow two ATI but I'll just buy one instead, which will be more powerful rather than two) Since it was proven by Toasty. And thank you for given me statistics, made my choice easier and clear since im now going with Nvidia cards (I really don't have a budget since im building slowly) So i think I'll go with Nvidia 8800 GTS. I don't really want an ultra series since I really won't need that much power.
                                        here the page im buying from: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/productlist....6&subid=927
                                        So does the more I pay the better still work or should I compare because I think thats the best with this website :D

                                        Oh also iv bought a new CPU and sold the other one, iv got is a AMD Phenom Quad Core 9600 Black Edition (Socket AM2) when i bought it it didn't say it does quad core but Phenom is the new quad core, I also think there isn't a duo version of it either so i think its model is just a quad, I also looked around abd found more info about my motherboard and yeah it does quad cores! So now iv got a quad core XD

                                        True Quad-core Desktop Processor
                                        - Unlocked Multiplier for the ultimate overclocking flexibility
                                        - 2.3Ghz clock speed
                                        - 2mb L2 cache
                                        - 2mb L3 cache
                                        - DDR2-1066 support
                                        - 65nm process technology
                                        - Integrated Memory Controller
                                        - Fast Hypertransport 3.0 technology
                                        - Cool & Quiet v2.0

                                        Once I get graphic card out of the way, I think everything come s a little cheaper.

                                        But thank you for the info Toasty, that really did help, graphcis card confuse me very much:) And thank you Max, your both a great help XD next will be RAm i think? any suggestions?

                                        #20   Toasty 

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                                          Posted 03 February 2008 - 02:44 AM

                                          Phenom's come in Quad and Dual core versions. Also, a 45nm core is better than a 65nm. Also, even with AMD's have Hyper Transport, Intel's CPU's still outperform AMD's new Phenom in gameing, but AMD's do better when it comes to number crunching programs like media players, photo editing programs, and CG stuff. But, The Phenom you bought will run faster than the other CPU you had.

                                          As for the graphics card, I'd suggest a factory overclocked 8800GT over the 512MB GTS. It's cheaper and will most likely offer the same performance.
                                          NewEgg has some good offers, they even have an 8800GT with a gig of ram for about $300. Take a look.

                                          But yes, your CPU is a quad core. Specs for it can also be found here.

                                          #21   Max 

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                                            Posted 03 February 2008 - 07:03 AM

                                            I would second Toasty's recommendations. Definitely get a 8800GT over the 8800GTS and save yourself some money. The marginal (if any) performance increase isn't worth the cost and won't be noticeable. If you intend to do overclocking anyways (why get the Black edition otherwise?), then you can always bump the clocks on the 8800GT to match or surpass a GTS. Just make sure you get an 8800GT with 512MB of memory (not 256MB).

                                            #22   Nick Presta 

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                                              Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:34 AM

                                              View Post.eugine, on Jan 12 2008, 05:03 PM, said:

                                              Maaaxx, would you get a floppy drive? Need some expert opinion here ^_~


                                              I was hesitant to buy a floppy drive so I bought a 13-in-1 card reader that has a floppy drive slot. It was 35 bucks and now I have everything I could ever need, input wise.





                                              As for the graphics card, I feel the best value/performance ratio is the 8800GT 512MB. It costs between 250 and 350 and outperforms the 8800GTS. If that doesn't fit your budget, the 8600GT is a good budget card but isn't incredibly powerful, but you get what you pay for, of course.

                                              Personally, I decided a couple years ago, to buy the 7900GS. It performs about the same as the 8600GT but it doesn't have DX10. I was running Windows XP at the time so DX10 wasn't available to me anyways. The 7900 model has been discontinued, AFAIK, but you may consider buying a cheaper card for the now and upgrading to the latest and greatest when you have more money (and not building the whole computer). The 8600GT is a good candidate for this, if you can find it cheaper than $200.

                                              #23   Toasty 

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                                                Posted 04 February 2008 - 12:09 AM

                                                http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList....eForce+8+series

                                                The search selections are off to the left. The 8600GT goes for about $100 or less, and the GTS for $210 or less. Though the $210 one is factory superclocked, so you get extra performance, and still get a warranty.


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