[Golden Legacy]

A topic I think is worth bringing up.

How much of a role do you think morality, faith, etc. should play in society's judicial court system, and the law in general?

Let me make it clear, first of all, that this is NOT A RELIGIOUS vs. ATHIESM TOPIC! IF YOU WANT TO DEBATE THAT, CLICK HERE.


That said, I'll clarify what I mean.

When you're to testify in court, you take an oath that you'll speak the truth.
"Under God" is found in both the US constitution, and in the Pledge of Allegiance.

While some people are against having prayer in schools, I actually don't think it's a bad idea - why not set aside a specific amount of time each day, for people of all different faiths to convene, and pray, or even just discuss religious issues? This way, people can still retain their faith, but have a fairer basis of it being represented in society.


So basically, when it comes down to it - should laws be entirely secular in nature? Can, and should they have, any input based on faith?

[PDM]

I'm not touching that one with a fourty-foot-pole.

I'll keep my opinion to myself though. (I'm christian for the record, so you might be able to figure out my opinion from there.)

[Elliott]

I don't think anyone, of any religion, has any right to legislate their morality. Laws should be based on common opinion. If the majority of people think something is a good idea, then it should be incorporated into the legal system. I don't think religious minorities of any kind should play any part in the legal system. That said, I'm also against an Atheist minority tampering with laws if it goes against the majority. As far as I'm concerned, it doesn't matter who you are, you shouldn't be manipulating a system which is aimed at protecting common interests.

[Golden Legacy]

Right, but Agatio - let's say if the "common interest" of the majority of the people is something that ALL people agree on (for example, all people, whether they are religious or not, believe that murder, rape, etc. is wrong).

How about then? Can the laws have some input based on faith?

[Elliott]

Well I'm not a politician so I suppose I don't really know how to combat that. But generally I think majority rules is a good rule of thumb.

[FlamingDuck]

Well, there's the whole separation of church and state thing...But if you're one of those people spazzing over the Pledge of Allegiance, others don't like you enough to listen to you. Like the people who complain to Wal Mart about the "Merry Christmas" posters. I think its ridiculous.

Prayer time is fine. If you don't have a religion, use the time to reflect on something.

[Toasty]

^ Exactly

Sure, I'm christian, so obviously I'm for a moment in class where we may pray, and even though I'd really want for some of the other students in my classroom to believe as I do, I wouldn't agree to it if you were being forced to pray, or take part in a religious 'event' that you are against.

Basically, I'm for in class prayer time, but only as long as people aren't forced to pray.

As for the morals thing, our country, and it's morals were based off of christian beliefes. Our morals started to decline when people tried to take the religious aspect out of everyday life. Back when my mom was a child, people felt safe enough to leavve their cars and houses unlocked. If you left your lights or engine on in your car, it was common courtesy to turn off the engine/lights for the person who forgot. Nowadays, doing that is against the law. It's considered breaking and entering. Leaving your doors unlocked? Sure, if you want burgelars at your doorstep. We've also had an increase in crimes such as murder, theft, rape, etc. This all started to occur more and more as religion was trying to be taken out of the picture. So I have a strong feeling that morals should be based off of religion. More specifically the Cristian faith, not because I'm a christian, but because our origional morals and constitution that worked so well were based off of it.

[Elliott]

What studies are there to back up your claim that Christian morals held the country together? I mean it's an interesting theory, but what evidence is there to suggest that's really the cause? My personal opinion is that there are a number of factors that have increased crime rate such as media influence, experimentation, and the exploitation of liberalism and freedom of expression. It's entirely possible to be a law abiding and integrous human being without being a Christian, or even religious. I think it's not entirely fair to say that your religion is what holds a country together.

[Ravenblade]

Considering the Western moral code is based almost entirely on Christian beliefs, I dont think you can argue that religion didnt get us to this point Agatio.

That said, morals are inconsistent and change with society - Our modern society uses religious morals less and less for better (greater tolerance) or worse (more violence and meaningless sex). The only problem, i would say, with removing religious ties from the law, is that once they're all gone, we will have empowered groups who are still religious (such as those who follow Islam - the only other strong religion in the world IMO) and will have a bunch of 'indifferents' left to deal with them. This could very well mean we'd end up getting pushed around ourselves.

I have seen the governments 'secular' approach to law and tolerance, and it involves us giving concession after concession to people who are NOT going to do the same for us when they get the chance. This essentially means, we're idiots.

[Toasty]

Agatio, on Jan 29 2007, 03:18 AM, said:

What studies are there to back up your claim that Christian morals held the country together? I mean it's an interesting theory, but what evidence is there to suggest that's really the cause? My personal opinion is that there are a number of factors that have increased crime rate such as media influence, experimentation, and the exploitation of liberalism and freedom of expression. It's entirely possible to be a law abiding and integrous human being without being a Christian, or even religious. I think it's not entirely fair to say that your religion is what holds a country together.

That's not exactly what I was trying to say. I'm just saying that our morals were based off of christian morals, and though there isn't any hard evidence to support that getting rid of religion was the cause, trend can be found that shows that as we rejected christianity more and more (and christianity is one the most looked down upon religions in the US), our morals declined as well. I'm just pointing out a patter I've seen over my few years being alive, and from the (true) stories my parents and grandparents have told me.